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Post by Kristjan on Sept 21, 2013 12:45:12 GMT
Just from the interest, I started thinking about similarities between 1250 bandit (new school) and gixer 1100w engines. They are not same at all, but one seems to be derived from the other.
Has anyone done some research about this, can some parts be swapped? Cyl. block with head, cams for example? It sure isn't straight fit, but does anyone know about cylinder spacings?
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fastbastard
Velociraptor
GSXR 1100W Streetfighter!
Posts: 26 
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Post by fastbastard on Sept 21, 2013 15:37:25 GMT
I don't think its usable.. the bore stroke on the 1250 is 79mmx64mm.. If the barrels chould fit..you need to bore out your gsxr 1100w top case. But if the crank fits? it would be a GREAT upgrade because of the 4mm extra stroke!! A gsxr1250w would be awesome!
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Post by Kristjan on Sept 21, 2013 16:00:27 GMT
Crank wont be usable, you dont even have to look close to see that they are soooo different. 1250 also has balancer shaft.
79mm bore itself would be great. 1100 block can be bored to 79,5 if bigger sleeves fitted, but most likely there will be problems with head gasket. 1250 block has nicasil bore, so there are no sleeves and it'll probably seal much better and be safe for street.
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Post by captain chaos on Sept 21, 2013 17:28:43 GMT
i happen to have a GSF1250 at work now, if you need any external engine dimensions let me know. Not opening the engine though since it's a customers bike.
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fastbastard
Velociraptor
GSXR 1100W Streetfighter!
Posts: 26
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Post by fastbastard on Sept 21, 2013 17:52:08 GMT
I have 79mm 12:1 cr pistons that will be fitted in my gsxr 11w.
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Post by Kristjan on Sept 21, 2013 21:32:36 GMT
I saw a dyno graph somewhere, gsf 1250 with mods: cams, 12:1 cr, headwork, ecu flash, headers, made about 150 rwhp and over 130 nm torque, which is quite good... I wonder what numbers can I expect from my 1100w with full exhaust, timed cams, k&n panel filter and factory pro jet kit. Already have new stock pistons in, but thinking about cleaning up the ports this winter. Not going to do serious porting myself... last time I did it was a two stroke russian bicycle engine for racing... oh, good memories from that. And here I'll go off topic. Captain chaos, I remembered that you live in lithuania, I hope you've seen at least one soviet motorbicycle in your country? Many were made in Latvia, Sarkana Zvaigzne factory, under the name Riga. Very popular "mopeds" in ex-soviet countrys like baltic states. Well, I've built one few years ago when I graduated 9th grade, had a garage and some tools. For racing purposes  It was Riga-13, with sidecar. They're racing similar things in Latvia, too.
p1.bikepics.com/2011%5C11%5C15%5Cbikepics-2302938-800.jpg
p1.bikepics.com/2011%5C11%5C15%5Cbikepics-2302939-full.jpg
p1.bikepics.com/2013%5C04%5C02%5Cbikepics-2537116-full.jpg
And my special invention... inspiration from Kawasaki AR125, but different: a reed valve inlet which cooperates with stock rotary valve to improve torque... and it actually boosted the bike better off the starting line! Lots of other modifications, too. Building this engine was cheap as chips compared to sports bikes, engine mods cost probably as much as a set of good tyres for a gsxr, did as much as I could all by myself... Now I have graduated school, I have fine machinery at work, but just don't have so much passion for so little engines any more. I guess that power has taken my love from them.
p1.bikepics.com/2011%5C11%5C15%5Cbikepics-2302941-full.jpg
p1.bikepics.com/2011%5C11%5C15%5Cbikepics-2302944-800.jpg
Raced one season, then quit. :/
Just for all of you to know, that I have sort of passion to improving and tuning engines. And it's a proper challenge to me to get things working when others can't.  Like I jetted and tuned my friend's carbs for free just because anyone else could'nt get the bike running. I f*ckin love it, when I do something that's impossible from other peolple's point of wiew!
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Post by captain chaos on Sept 22, 2013 7:03:15 GMT
i have lived in LT since 2005, and don't know much about Sovjet era motorcycles. The only ones still riding around here are flat twins, Ural and Dnepr and stuff. Sometimes i see and old Jawa.
I am known locally for "wasting a lot of money on old shitheap Suzuki's", people don't understand why i do it, a newer GSX-R is cheaper than what my turbo EFE will cost in the end. But if they need to ask, they'll never understand.
Fuck them.
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Post by Kristjan on Sept 22, 2013 8:49:40 GMT
I see what you mean there. But if anyone have access to an opened gsf 1250 engine, I'd like to have some mesurements... if possible.  |
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Post by mattturbocar on Sept 22, 2013 12:57:41 GMT
GSXR1100w and gsf1250 have same bore spacing.
Barrels are not interchangeable though as 2 of the cylinderhead bolt holes are in different position on the GSF (moved by 3-4mm). I think they have been repositioned to prevent the barrels being put on the wrong way around. The dowels are also moved.
Water feeds are a little different too, but that is just pipework.
Cam chain is a bit different too, but probably can be fiddled.
If you did want to put gsf1250s barrels and pistons on a gsxr1100w, then you can use Gen2 busa conrods, and gsf headgasket. Not sure what compression this gives.
I have got most of the parts to do this, but I haven't made the time to 'move' the holes. So not sure whether there are other challenges.
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Post by Kristjan on Sept 22, 2013 15:48:23 GMT
That's really good info. Have you compared the cylinder heads between the two? Does it seem like cams are interchangeable?
Would be interesting to know block height from bottom mating surface to the top. Busa rods are a bit longer and would compensate if the block is taller.
Cylinder heads are also a bit different, especially near the cam chain tunnel, where 1100 has 1 6mm bolt but 1250 has 2 of them, wonder if 1100 head would fit onto those big barrels without too serious modifications. As I see on the picture, at least dowels appear to be on similar locations.
I could measure every top end part on a 1100w. I have one engine in bits at the garage, so not a problem.
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fastbastard
Velociraptor
GSXR 1100W Streetfighter!
Posts: 26
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Post by fastbastard on Sept 23, 2013 13:07:42 GMT
I saw a dyno graph somewhere, gsf 1250 with mods: cams, 12:1 cr, headwork, ecu flash, headers, made about 150 rwhp and over 130 nm torque, which is quite good... I wonder what numbers can I expect from my 1100w with full exhaust, timed cams, k&n panel filter and factory pro jet kit. Already have new stock pistons in, but thinking about cleaning up the ports this winter. Not going to do serious porting myself... I think you should have about 150rwhp 120nm with your mods. Throw it on the dyno for results. My 11w has 145rwhp stock exhaust dynojet and ramair pod filters, vhr advancer. Im not in too two strokes at all. I love oldskool suki's very tunable and loads off torque |
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Post by pasis on Sept 23, 2013 17:56:19 GMT
I wanted to install a block from the GSF. I bought a gasket under the block, compared ... To install it will be very difficult. It will take a lot of welding and milling. I think it will lose meaning. Simply then milled big block. If interested, I can make a photo gaskets superimposed on each other. Incidentally, the valve and springs and these motors are identical. For head GSF exist only camshafts yoshimura Stage 1. They are expensive and not aggressive enough |
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fastbastard
Velociraptor
GSXR 1100W Streetfighter!
Posts: 26
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Post by fastbastard on Sept 23, 2013 19:17:01 GMT
photo's Always good!
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Post by Kristjan on Oct 24, 2013 14:03:05 GMT
Pasis, maybe you can make picture of the gaskets? I'm still anxious about it... :/
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Post by pasis on Nov 3, 2013 14:44:04 GMT
Send me e-mail address, I'll send the drawing. I do not know how to put this file here. By the way, my first moped, it's a moped Delta, from Riga. Since it began my motorcycle career and passion for tuning |
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It was Riga-13, with sidecar. They're racing similar things in Latvia, too. 
Like I jetted and tuned my friend's carbs for free just because anyone else could'nt get the bike running. I f*ckin love it, when I do something that's impossible from other peolple's point of wiew!
